As Russia steps up sabotage, interference and intimidation across Europe, how far is Vladimir Putin prepared to go?

Former MI6 chief Sir John Scarlett joins Tom and Patrick to explain what Putin wants in Ukraine, whether Russia could escalate into a direct confrontation with NATO, and why intelligence back channels may be crucial to preventing escalation.

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• 05:28 - Did the West misjudge Putin?
• 09:46 - Is Putin under pressure?
• 15:04 - What does Putin want in Ukraine?
• 17:30 - Russia’s hybrid war against NATO
• 23:49 - Why the CIA Chief went to Moscow

Guest: Sir John Scarlett, former MI6 Chief and co-founder of SC Strategy

Hosts: General Sir Patrick Sanders and Tom Newton Dunn

Patrick brings his experience as a former head of the British Army to the podcast. He is also a Conservative peer and advises the party on defence.

Producer: Julia Webster, Shabnam Grewal

Executive producer: Priyanka Deladia

Image: Kathia Mestanza, Getty

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